Warren Jeffs, aka Weenie Rat Face, apparently admitted to his brother–in a taped conversation–that he has NEVER considered himself a prophet or called of God. Ain’t that great?

“He said he is the greatest of all sinners and, in so many words, worked his way to be the leader and prophet when he knew he wasn’t called of God to be a prophet,” a law enforcement source familiar with the conversation told the Deseret Morning News.

Sheesh. I could have told them that…..

A former LDS Bishop, Timothy O’Sean McCleve, in Harrisville, Utah, has been charged with three counts of forcible sex abuse, according to the Salt Lake Tribune. Apparently, McCleve used his position of trust in the community–Mormon bishop!–to gain the trust of these three young girls. Of course, the fact he was NO LONGER the bishop when the actual sexual abuse took place is something that is being shouted from the rooftops here.

If–as Mormons have always claimed–callings come from God, why did God not know in advance what this bishop was going to do? He never would have been so readily accepted in this community–and by these girls–had they not been encouraged by their parents to trust the man. Why didn’t God know that McCleve was a pervert and pedophile?

Apparently, the three young girls told their parents about the abuse after another Mormon male, a first grade teacher in Riverton, Frank Hall, was arrested for the abuse of a child. (Apparently, many more have stepped up to claim Hall abused them.)

Patriarchy and the “absolute” nature of Mormonism–a complete trust in male priesthood leaders can have heartwrenching consequences–create an environment in which this kind of abuse thrives. My heart goes out to the young victims.

Everybody knows the MoMos don’t like coffee. Well, that’s not ENTIRELY true. The mainstream church SHUNS coffee as a violation of the Word of Wisdom. Frankly, for me, this is a BIG stretch, because HERE is what the WoW actually says:

9 And again, hot drinks are not for the body or belly.

No mention of coffee or tea. Sure as hell no mention of the dreaded CAFFEINE, a substance so vile that many a believing Mormon has put their OWN EYES OUT rather than be forced to consume the evil C-word. And hordes more drink it daily, but that’s another post. I feel a “faith promoting rumor” coming on.

Back to the matter at hand. If, in fact, one were to take Joseph Smith at his word, the hot cocoa routinely consumed in GIGANTIC proportions at many ward and church functions is actually VERBOTEN. Hot, remember. HOT! I wonder, however, if this should not extend itself to hot soup and broth? I mean, they are HOT. And where the heck did CAFFEINE end up coming out of that? Give me a break.

What was I talking about? Oh yeah. I spotted THIS story on the local news. And then I found a link to a CNN story with a GREAT headline.

Mormons miffed over coffee-swilling angel image

Says the story:

TAYLORSVILLE, Utah (AP) — For a coffee shop, T-shirts of a Mormon angel with java flowing into his trumpet are selling well. But they don’t have the blessing of religious leaders.

The shirts have upset the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. Not only is the angel Moroni a revered figure — Mormons believe he appeared to church founder Joseph Smith — but church members are discouraged from drinking coffee.

Can I just be the first one here to say that it is not HARD to Miff the Mormons? Miffed Mormons are a centegral part of daily life here at Chez Collins.

We get a lot of mileage out of Miffed Mormons.

That said, the actual BIGWIGS up at CHURCH HEADQUARTERS are having their say in the Miffed Mormons Mess.

Says the story:

The church informed Beazer that the angel’s image is a registered trademark.

Registered TRADEMARK? Are you freaking kidding me? If you ever NEEDED proof that this is a business first, and a “religion” remotely further down the corporate tree, here it is.

If this was a RELIGION, they would have appealed to the owner to respect their religious icon. Not the Mormons, though. Oh no. They just threaten to sue for their registered TRADEMARK.

What’s next? A patent for Jesus Jammies? You can keep that, my friend….

I suspect next they will try to trademark Jesus. The Catholics and Christians will NOT be buying that one….

I was perusing comments this morning, and I ran across this one from Robin, an active Saint.

It saddens me that no one thinks I know the history of my own religion, that you all think that you’re the first to give me all of the points you’ve all outlined, that you assume that I haven’t had the same questions and suspisions that arise in this very blog, that just because I call myself a “Saint,” that all of you lump me, an individual, into a most narrow category, and that you call my words incorherent diarrhea just because we disagree. I was wrong to think that anyone would be interested in hearing my insignificant opinion. I guess there’s no interest in hearing from any actual Latter-day Saints in this blog. And why should there be? You guys seem to already have every single one of us figured out. I don’t even see the need to contiue this website for that matter. I certainly won’t waste any more time here. I hope that you’ll each catch a glimor of the hipocrasy and narrow-mindedness that exists in your own hearts and words. I’m sorry we couldn’t all discuss our thoughts in a more humane manner, but if your intention was to drive me off your site, then you’ve succeeded.

High fives to all

First of all, Robin, this is MY blog and MY site, and I have not been one of the ones “driving you away.” In fact, I’ve been kind of busy with revisions, and pretty much missed your comments. So I went back and read them. And I see that you are what I think of as a “progressive” Mormon. There are many of these out there, who have REALLY thought these things through, and are bothered by them, and in many instances, would like change. However, at the end of the day, you are still very much believing, something that most here will simply not be able to comprehend.
While I don’t consider your comments verbal diarrhea, they still do not ring valid to me. You are not offering me ANY real reason to accept this doctrine, i.e. polygamy. You don’t even have a grasp on it yourself. You wrote:

I hope that as a Mormon, I can shed some light on this issue. YES, Latter-day Saints DID practice polygamy up until the 1890’s, when it was then outlawed by the LDS church. (Remember, “Mormon” is an umbrella word that can mean more that one existing church.) And YES, we do believe that the practice of polygamy will resureface after the second comming of Christ. BUT NOT FOR ALL!!!!! There is no definate doctrine on how all of this will work. But polygamy will not be meant for everybody. That is not to say that those who will practice it are better than those who don’t. Some say that because there are more women (and that women generally tend to me more faithful) that there will be some sort of need for polygamy. Again, that is not doctrine. Just a widely held belief. As for temple marriage. If a man is sealed to a woman and she dies, he may then be sealed to another woman without the first sealing being broken. YES that is a form of polygamy and that man will have two wives in the eternities. NO women cannot be sealed twice. ITS WEIRD. I know. I don’t have a good explanation for it. Or even a bad one for that matter.

Unfortunately, not having a good explanation for it does NOT shed any light at all upon the practice of polygamy. You just repeated what others have said in the past, which is probably why someone accused you of verbal diarrhea. You are spouting out what you have heard in the past, without any substance to SHED LIGHT on it.

And frankly, I get this. I understand why it happens. There IS NO VALID DEFENSE OF POLYGAMY. I keep asking for it, and no one gives it to me.

What I would like is for someone–anyone–to bring to me a VALID reason for polygamy. I don’t want to hear the history. I know the history, just like you do. I also know what I was told, just like you. But it doesn’t add up.

And if possible, I would like to keep the discussion calm and without name-calling. I TRULY want to know how believing Mormons can defend polygamy, when there is no basis for the practice, except perhaps, “Because God said so.” That one isn’t going to fly.

As for not being accepted here, Robin, I don’t think it’s personal. I think the people who comment are asking you to really think through what you are saying, and if it doesn’t mesh, they are going to tell you. This is not a “blind faith” blog. It never will be. That said, I encourage Mormons to visit and comment. However, it is entirely possible that your reception will be like the one ex-Mormons receive at the FAIR Boards. There, a person such as myself is POUNCED UPON immediately and treated like Joseph Smith at a cocktail reception for the last two women on the face of the earth. So it goes both ways. If you comment on an ex-Mormon blog, you should probably expect some static, especially if you are not offering up valid arguments.

That said, I took your comments this way. I think you really do want to have some dialogue with former Mormons, and you explained that not all of the beliefs are EASY for you to understand, either. You just believe the CHURCH is true, and thus, you have to find a way to dampen those doubts because the end product is what you want.

And that’s okay, I guess. As long as you aren’t going to try and defend it in public arenas, because that becomes a bit of a sticky wicket.

One of your comments regarding the history of the Mormons was filled with errors. You said:

And thirdly, as far as Mormons fleeing the country in the mid 1800s, it was not because we couldn’t do what we wanted. It’s because we were being KILLED. FACT: Up until the 1970’s it was legal in the state of Ohio to shoot a Mormon on sight!!! Sadly, those types of details were left out of the history books. Many Mormons, were slautered by their fellow countrymen. We were chased out of the country. If we didn’t leave, I don’t think there would be many left. I hope this was helpful. I’ll try to check back later if there are any questions.

The state in question was not Ohio, it was Missouri. And in truth, only about sixty Mormons were killed, and the MORMONS went on the offensive, not the Missourians. They were ordered to settle there, by Joseph Smith, and the Missourians were worried about the influx of Saints, who tended to vote in “blocs” as they were told. It’s all very well documented, and while I do not believe the Mormons who died SHOULD have died, it was not a mass persecution and execution like the Holocaust or other such black stains on humanity.

Again, I do not think the Mormons should have been killed, but likewise, I do not think the victims of the Mountain Meadows Massacre should have been killed by the Mormons either, for much the same reason.

Both, I believe, were killed out of fear and ignorance. Much of what happened MUST be attributed, also, to the ERA in which it happened.

At any rate, Robin, you appear to want a dialogue, but if so, you must be prepared to hear things you are not going to like. You are certainly welcome here. I’m sorry if the attacks seemed personal, but they are not. See, here’s the thing. Most ex-Mormons arrive at the place they are at with great cost to their personal lives. You lose family members, respect, community, friends, support systems. When you realize the Mormon Church could not POSSIBLY be true, suddenly you are accused of being tempted by Satan, or not listening to the whisperings of the spirit, or, worst of all, of HAVING BEEN OFFENDED and leaving because of that. Please. What kind of stupid excuse is that?

Those of us who find ourselves here have studied, researched, explored, and spent many, many hours pondering the very serious life decisions that come with leaving a religion behind.

Most of us leave behind family members, who spend the rest of their lives trying to lure us back in.

As a “born in the church” Mormon, I am here to tell you that walking away from a birth religion is probably one of the hardest things a person ever has to do. I know that the common Mormon party line is that it is just easier to not live the Mormon priniciples. This is not true. It’s MUCH easier to be a Mormon. Your every step on every path is already outlined for you.

For those reasons, and others, there are no easy answers for ex- Mormons. You cannot expect to show up and hand out the standard lame excuses, and expect them to be embraced.

That won’t fly in this community of people who have had to fight for their very right to exist peacefully as Ain’ts in a land of Saints. You believe. We don’t. If you don’t offer good reasons why WE should return to YOUR state, then your reasons will not be accepted.

It’s as simple as that.

So, one of Gayle Ruzicka’s children has passed away. She has a lot of them, and I am not privy to her family history, so I have no idea where Josh Ruzicka fell in the mix, but I would like to feel compassion for her. And yet, when she feels no compassion for anyone ELSE, how do I do this? This is a woman who has destroyed lives, all in the name of her GOD and HER idea of morality. How does one empathize with that?

I guess I will do my best. Godspeed, Josh Ruzicka. I don’t know why you died, at such a young age, but I hope you have found peace.

Gayle? This pain you must feel? Remember it. Don’t ever act or opine or try to force others to bend to your moral will, without thinking that perhaps it could have dire consequences. Please.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

I heard tonight on the news that Copper Hills High School is giving out a beer stein and a champagne glass as souvenirs for junior prom. Apparently, they have been doing this for years. And a FATHER is up in arms about this, saying it is inappropriate.

I know, I know, you are waiting for me to lambast him, but wait… Beer steins and champagne glasses? I watched this news story, and thought, WHAT? And no one has commented on this until NOW? These are HIGH SCHOOL KIDS. Boys and girls who don’t even have the sense to move out of the road when a CAR is driving toward them. And this is Utah. We don’t even let our children have CLUBS that might even NOD toward acceptance of “alternative” lifestyles (see above note about Ruzicka).

Why has this been going on for years? Why don’t you just HAND these kids a GUN and encourage some Russian roulette? Maybe give them some cyanide and a recipe for Kool-aid? PEOPLE… Kids do NOT need encouragement for destructive behavior, and teenagers do NOT have much luck with self-monitoring or shut off buttons.

Okay, I know that this whole issue is probably silly, and that it IS, after all, just some glassware, but it IS glassware that is used–and identified–expressly with alcohol. If you are going to give a souvenir, give them a chastity belt keyring, or a Friends of Bill T-shirt.

Stay AWAY from the alcohol endorsements. This is UTAH people. You’re known for extreme control. This is a time to use it. Don’t encourage alcohol use in mutants. And these are teenagers. Again, they WALK DOWN THE STREET AND FACE DOWN CARS LIKE RABID BULLS. Mutants. Don’t give them any ammunition. Sheesh.